We are not living organisms! @_@

[Mitera Nikkou]

Not really. What's a good conductor of electricity? Water! XD

[Kether]

Not really. What's a good conductor of electricity? Water! XD

No Its not.

[Mitera Nikkou]

It conducts just fine for people to die when something electrical is exposed to water and someone's in contact with it. We're not talking about pure water; body water is hardly pure. The presence of water can also be a factor in whether you live or not when struck by lightning, whether if you're partly or wholly submerged, or just wet from rain.

[Kether]

It conducts just fine for people to die when something electrical is exposed to water and someone's in contact with it. We're not talking about pure water; body water is hardly pure. The presence of water can also be a factor in whether you live or not when struck by lightning, whether if you're partly or wholly submerged, or just wet from rain.

The electrolytes are what make it a Conductor not the water. Its the salt on people that make them get electricuted..

[Mitera Nikkou]

But water is still a part of it. For instance, most of a lightning strike will pass over a body rather than through it, because dry skin and (especially) clothing tend to not be good conductors. However, should you be wet, more of the charge will pass through your body, and the more that does then the more internal damage that one suffers. It doesn't matter if water itself isn't conductive; it's still a carrier of what is conductive, and that matters just as much.

[Helel]

Seriously, Nikkou. Water does not conduct electricty. At all. salts conduct it, whether dissolved in solution, or in liquid form, but not water.

All water is, is a convenient medium to store important stuff. Otherwise, no.

In the case of lightning strikes, how many times you get struck by lightning while you're wet, do you think that water is pure, uncontaminated water? Never, especially in a rain storm.

And even then, the conductors of the water would be whatever grim or such you have on you that would attract the current to your body, not the water, whether it be inside or outside your body.

Remember calcium and the other compounds in your body? Those are good conductors that would lead to your ultimate demise, but not that water.

[Mitera Nikkou]

Sheesh, you haven't been listening to anything that I've said, Helel. I've already distinguished between the conductivity of pure water and water with stuff in it, and that water is a medium to carry said stuff to make the conditions more likely (and/or make the effects worse) for electrocution where there wouldn't have been otherwise. Doesn't anyone listen to me, or are you staring at my nekkid body or something? Honestly... I make a case about how water does matter in causing worse conditions for electric shock, and it's like I've said nothing. Y.Y

[Kether]

Sheesh, you haven't been listening to anything that I've said, Helel. I've already distinguished between the conductivity of pure water and water with stuff in it, and that water is a medium to carry said stuff to make the conditions possible for electrocution where there wouldn't have been otherwise. Doesn't anyone listen to me, or are you staring at my nekkid body or something? Honestly... I make a case about how water does matter in causing worse conditions for electric shock, and it's like I've said nothing. Y.Y

But its not the water that makes it special. Its the impurities. Which brings us back to the beginning. Its not the water in our bodies that makes it special its the other stuff. Water is completely unspecial.

[Mitera Nikkou]

But its not the water that makes it special. Its the impurities.

I've already made my case and I'm sticking with it. It's not my fault if anyone doesn't understand it.

Its not the water in our bodies that makes it special its the other stuff. Water is completely unspecial.

For what? Life or being electrocuted? As for electrocution, I stand by the fact that water can play a role in making it worse, and increasing the chance. As for life, the other stuff would be nothing without water. Nothing. And, of course, vice versa applies as well. But there's still more water. ;p

[Kether]

But its not the water that makes it special. Its the impurities.

I've already made my case and I'm sticking with it. It's not my fault if anyone doesn't understand it.

Its not the water in our bodies that makes it special its the other stuff. Water is completely unspecial.

For what? Life or being electrocuted? As for electrocution, I stand by the fact that water can play a role in making it worse, and increasing the chance. As for life, the other stuff would be nothing without water. Nothing. And, of course, vice versa applies as well. But there's still more water. ;p

I am sticking with life would be lif without water. and People are electricuted without water.. so ultimately water is second rate.

[Helel]

I've already made my case and I'm sticking with it. It's not my fault if anyone doesn't understand it.

if that's the case, then you need to be precise, because I missed that completely in this discussion thus far.

As for life, the other stuff would be nothing without water. Nothing. And, of course, vice versa applies as well. But there's still more water. ;p

Life would be nothing without a vast array of things, such as carbon which is used in lipids, sugars, nucleic acids- everything else as well. Same goes to hydrogen and oxygen, individually as well. Water is just primarily a useful medium which could be replaced by other compounds if life on earth hadn't had an abundance of water already. But as Lian said, without water, it'd just be life without water.

Water itself lacks a lot of the properties which say, Carbon has, such as the ability to bond to four different atoms at a time with an sp3 hydridized orbitals, which water can't do, since all of its interactions are all polar by nature, and generally are interactions of hydrogen bonding. But those weak bonds are meaningless if there wasn't the solid bonds with carbon and a slew of other particles.

[Mitera Nikkou]

Lian:

Without water what would be left of our bodies? A little pile of fine sand, made up of tiny minerals and other things, around what's left of the bones? That doesn't seem like life to me. Seems more like some bones with some seasoning all over them.

Helel:

It doesn't matter if water itself isn't conductive

It conducts just fine for people to die when something electrical is exposed to water and someone's in contact with it. We're not talking about pure water; body water is hardly pure.

Lian's and your own responses afterward, respectively:

Seriously, Nikkou. Water does not conduct electricty. At all.

The electrolytes are what make it a Conductor not the water.

How much more precise must I be? Seriously.

Video Professor: "So, please... Read my product." :O

I'm well aware about a lot of these things, but water is still a major component to life as we know it. My argument is simply that we are water-based because there is more water than anything else put together, and water itself isn't considered life. And whatever the rest would be without water couldn't possibly support the kind of living organisms that we are by itself. We get our life from all of these things together, but there is more water than carbon. And I don't say hydrogen-based because hydrogen alone doesn't create the effect that water does. Do you say that one part of a machine is the machine? Of course not. Take away one of any of the parts that make it work and the machine won't work and thus can't be defined for what it does since it doesn't do it anymore. So it's water that is the basis, because you don't get its effects by just having one or two hydrogen atoms, just like you don't get a human body with just water or just the myriads of other stuff.

And I really, truly don't know how else to put it.

[Nylena]

Life came from the oceans, the oceans of the world make up of 70% of it. We are made up of the same amount of water as the Earth, our Mother. Water is the force that surrounds us and penetrates us and binds the world together.


Is pure water better than natural?

Personally, gimme a glass, a funnel and a rainstorm anyday.

[Mitera Nikkou]

You better be careful if you do that. I doubt that you'll get a trip from that acid. XD

[Helel]

Okay, I'm gonna be a bit repetitive in this post, so I'm gonna apologize in advance for how I go about this. I generally hate doing this sort of thing, but it's the only way I can think to go about explaining myself.

My argument is simply that we are water-based because there is more water than anything else put together, and water itself isn't considered life.

Okay that's more like it.

So I'm going to approach this differently, cause prior methods aren't working for me.

First off, when people look at this statement:

70% of the human body is water

Do they really mean that? No, not at all. Look at it this way: Within your body, the closest thing you actually have to water, at all, is your blood. Quantitatively, the average human adult (weighing about 150 pounds) has 5 liters of blood in them. That's about 20 pounds of a human's body weight, tops. Not even even close to 70% of your body weight, correct?

So where on god's green earth is the rest of all that water? Here's a hint, it's not even water, IE in the form of two hyrdogens bonded to one oxygen. The MAJORITY of that "water" is broken down into hydrogen and hydroxide ions. But here's the kicker, if they're not bonded to each other, what are they bonded to?

Carbon.

The reason why scientists bother to say "Life on Earth is Carbon based" is not because there is MORE carbon in the human body. Because there isn't, and by mass, there's more water than carbon not only by numbers, but also because each individual molecule of water weighs more than carbon. But, carbon is the BASE, because it bonds to darn near everything, including a lot of water.

Examples? Sugars and amino acids are two considerable players to where water is used in conjunction with carbon at its center. This I think is my response to this:

And whatever the rest would be without water couldn't possibly support the kind of living organisms that we are by itself. We get our life from all of these things together, but there is more water than carbon.

(I will note that other systems in the body have water in them as well, predominantly the digestive system and the like, but a great deal of that is really acids, and not water either, so I'm sticking to blood as my primary example. But yeah, just note that the majority of water in the body is broken up and bonded to carbons and other central atoms like phosphorus)

But, back to this point:

And I don't say hydrogen-based because hydrogen alone doesn't create the effect that water does. Do you say that one part of a machine is the machine? Of course not.

Alot of the "water" in the human body IS broken down, but not into separate hydrogen or oxygen atoms, but instead into the hydrogen and hydroxide ions, which then bond with carbon, predominately, and with other atoms like phosphorus. Only a small percentage, like that in your blood, is actually in the form of "water" molecules. Otherwise, people would be little more than giant water balloons, though that WOULD be an entertaining idea.

Take away one of any of the parts that make it work and the machine won't work and thus can't be defined for what it does since it doesn't do it anymore.

I'll agree with you here, now. The way things are on earth, we gotta have water.

So it's water that is the basis, because you don't get its effects by just having one or two hydrogen atoms, just like you don't get a human body with just water or just the myriads of other stuff.

But ultimately, carbon is more essential, as carbon forms the BASE of our DNA (the deoxy RIBO nucleic acid, the base of the DNA is actually a five carbon sugar), forms the center of our amino acids, forms the center of all sugars which provide us energy, forms the center lipids that make up our cell walls, and so forth.

Even if there may not be more of carbon by weight, it has a more powerful role in the human body, because by weight, carbon can bond to much more than water can.

Now, why do I keep harping about bonding? Because generally, life is just a bunch of chemical reactions in a sustained environment, where bonds are broken and created. The center of all these compounds being formed and destroyed is not water, though it makes a nice catalyst at times or a medium for these reactions to occur, but it doesn't have the critical role of actually being in the center of all that action like carbon.

That's why I will stubbornly say "humans are carbon based lifeforms" and not "water based" or so help me, my professors will kill me. XD